Jaysen's Helms 24

Questions about boat repairs with our resins and fiberglass: hull patches, transoms and stringers, foam, rot etc.
terrulian
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Re: Jaysen's Helms 24

Post by terrulian »

OK, I'm back, and it's time to butt in!

As to getting out of your slip, I think the main problem was handling, or mis-handling, the tiller on the engine, which should be very effective. With that, you can counteract any prop-walk, which should not bother you in a boat where the prop is not fixed. Small boats with outboards are much more maneuverable than inboards.

Jeff said,
Beating upwind in a narrow channel is the toughest challenge sheeting/winching-wise, that's when you really need 3-4 hands. I've found that(yes, I know you know how to sail, probably a lot more competently than me, but I'm the one typing, I have the conch!) if you can get the new working sheet all the way in and wrapped before the jib fills on the new tack, it's pretty effortless: you don't need to tail because you don't need to winch, it's already all the way in. Admittedly this means you really need to keep some way-on throughout the turn to ensure that sheeting tight on the new tack will actually be effective: if you lose too much speed then you're going to need to reach a little deeper initially, which then means winching, which then means tailing, which then means you need 3-4 hands again. Of course, 50% of the time the jib sheet will hang on some damned thing mid-tack; the open bow hatch, a stanchion, the chute pole, a paddleboard, or a spouse/sibling/niece/nephew/pet, and the whole thing goes to !@#$ in a hurry and threatens to upend your gin/tonic, but that's why I sail around in circles in Henderson Harbor and am not rounding the horn. Got to know your limits!
Single-handed with non-tailing winches, do what he says but on the tack you probably won't get the jib sheet tight enough. Stabilize yourself on the new tack and then pinch up for a second with the sheet in your hand. When the jib luffs, haul it in. Like a man. You don't need no stinking winch handle.

As to those cam cleats for the jib sheets: Lose them. A hazard if you fall into them. The reason this was probably done was that if you mount the cam cleat on the coaming, it will be hard to lower the sheet enough to get it between the jaws. Two better ways to address this are: mount a block aft of the winch that holds the cam cleat at a proper angle, or use a horn cleat as Jeff suggests. You don't have to do a proper cleat hitch on every tack; just two wraps will do it and in fact, I would recommend never putting a cleat hitch on a sheet.

As to the storm jib or trysail: What the hell, man? Two deep reefs for the main and get yourself a headsail with a furler. Headsails meant to be reefed have a foam luff which will make for a better shape when they are wound up a bit. If you have the money, get a 100% and about a 135%, both with foam luffs. Do you really want to go forward when the wind is "freshening," as the old-timers euphemistically say? No.

Speaking of going forward, I suggest running the reefing lines aft for the main. I didn't do this in my big boat for several reasons, although a lot of sailors prefer lines run aft especially on blue water boats. I don't want to go into it, but I prefer not to. However, on a small boat that you will be single-handing, you're going to have a hell of a time going forward to reef if you have no self-steering. Even with lines run aft it is a bit of a circus getting it done in a blow, but hey, you could stay home and watch Netflix.
Last edited by terrulian on Mon May 10, 2021 4:28 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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terrulian
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Re: Jaysen's Helms 24

Post by terrulian »

One more thing: In regard to jacklines: Do you have a dodger on that boat? Whether you do or not, here's my recommendation:
1) In the cockpit, one line down the center, beginning so you can clip in before leaving the companionway, and ending aft at a point where, if you are tethered in, you can reach the lower gudgeon but not any farther.
2) From forward of the cockpit, one on each side run from the nearest stanchion, so you can clip in before leaving the cockpit. These go to the mast only.
3) From there, one from the mast forward to the stem. Now, people will object that this requires unclipping. That is so, but you have the mast to hold onto. If it makes you nervous, get a double tether with two clips.

Most people run their lines from just forward of the cockpit to the bow, but think how close you are to the rail. If you go over on the low side and no one's with you, you're done. With a line going to the mast, the only place you'll be very vulnerable is right at the bow, and there's no workaround for that. See above regarding Netflix.
Last edited by terrulian on Tue May 11, 2021 6:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Jaysen
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Re: Jaysen's Helms 24

Post by Jaysen »

Tony,

I know I can count on you for a switch kick to adz when needed.

Cam-cleats need to stay for now. And by “for now” I mean until I finish installing new tank, complete the winch backing plates, address yet more wiring issues and build new washboards and retaining components (the trim that holds them on). When I do replace the cams I’m likely to just move them from this brackets to the “combing” aft of the winches. I need to try a few things first.

Boat currently has roller furler and 110 jib has line luff. A “practice unfurl” at the dock was done and I’m happy with the shape at various positions. Winds were light (5kn) so that and we may change with real wind. Main sail reefing is a fecalfest. I need to sort it out around the lazy jacks. Planning to do that when I can get the sail up on the first sail.

No dodger or bimney on this gal. My jack line plan was to go from the aft cleats (6” forward of transom) forward to the bow cleats. This would give me a continuous, free run the length of the boat. I see the point of central in cockpit. My tethers are long enough I could probably just run from an anchor at the companionway to the mast (15’ tether when stretched). The only reason to be forward of the mast is anchor or “oh crap” with the furler/jib. I guess launch/retrieve on spinnaker would be a reason in good weather.

My plan for singlehanding right now is a more “1.25 handing”. Mrs WILL be available for tiller duty when we are inshore and things are smoothish. If it gets too lumpy for her motor goes down. In the open I’ll be using jib sheet based self steering. I have the blocks on the tow rail to accommodate. These positions together should make the need for self tailing all about convenience until we move up in the program or boat size.

Much of this is subject to change on Wednesday. Specifically this Wednesday. That’s our target to untie and spread the canvas.
My already completed 'Lil Bit'. A Martens Goosen V12 set up to sail me to the fishing holes.
Currently working on making a Helms 24 our coastal cruiser.
“Mark Twain/Samuel Clemens” wrote:Eat a live frog first thing in the morning and nothing worse will happen to you the rest of the day.
Jaysen wrote: Mon Apr 29, 2019 3:44 pm I tried to say something but God thought I was wrong and filled my mouth with saltwater. I kept my pie hole shut after that.

terrulian
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Re: Jaysen's Helms 24

Post by terrulian »

OK, keep us updated. :D
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Jaysen
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Re: Jaysen's Helms 24

Post by Jaysen »

Cold front is expected tomorrow. Looks like Wednesday is out for first trip.

See? I can use common sense! It’s just not fun.

Not sure if I’ll get anything worth noting completed. Need to take care of some job hunting stuff that I’ve put off a bit. I do have one big thing that is easy that I’ll try to get done ASAP.
My already completed 'Lil Bit'. A Martens Goosen V12 set up to sail me to the fishing holes.
Currently working on making a Helms 24 our coastal cruiser.
“Mark Twain/Samuel Clemens” wrote:Eat a live frog first thing in the morning and nothing worse will happen to you the rest of the day.
Jaysen wrote: Mon Apr 29, 2019 3:44 pm I tried to say something but God thought I was wrong and filled my mouth with saltwater. I kept my pie hole shut after that.

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Jaysen
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Re: Jaysen's Helms 24

Post by Jaysen »

Good news bad news.

We have a short weather window (3hr) this morning to get some off the dock time in.

Mrs told me to hike up my skirt and get her out on the water. No idea if we will get photos/vids as I don’t like buying phones due to sending them into the deep.

Here goes.
My already completed 'Lil Bit'. A Martens Goosen V12 set up to sail me to the fishing holes.
Currently working on making a Helms 24 our coastal cruiser.
“Mark Twain/Samuel Clemens” wrote:Eat a live frog first thing in the morning and nothing worse will happen to you the rest of the day.
Jaysen wrote: Mon Apr 29, 2019 3:44 pm I tried to say something but God thought I was wrong and filled my mouth with saltwater. I kept my pie hole shut after that.

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Jaysen
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Re: Jaysen's Helms 24

Post by Jaysen »

Success!

https://youtu.be/HpNCyH0wIic

We didn't get sails up due to weather moving in. We did get all the maneuvering done. I also managed to get her 75% docked under power. That means backing into our slip.

Now that 75% part deserves some explanation. The motor decided to cough and sputter after about 30min of puttering around out on the harbor. It kept running right up until we entered the super tight "peg a boat then backup" maneuver. Then she died. In reverse. Luckily I was expecting things to go wrong and was able to manually push her in the right direction (much to the surprise of the crowd gathered to see a boat actually move) and get lines to the dockhands. There was much ado about "calm action" as the Mrs and I made a great team fending off hazards like it was our favorite pastime activity (it isn't).

We did find that we can backup just fine if ...
1. all backsides aft and port.
2. lower RPM as once she cavs/aerates it's just a waste.
3. motor rotation helps once you get #1 and #2 down.

So... 9.9 is adequate to move the boat. Motor needs someone smarter to figure out the sputter and die. Weight distribution is the key for us at this point and eliminates the need for a new lifting bracket.

All in all a win!
My already completed 'Lil Bit'. A Martens Goosen V12 set up to sail me to the fishing holes.
Currently working on making a Helms 24 our coastal cruiser.
“Mark Twain/Samuel Clemens” wrote:Eat a live frog first thing in the morning and nothing worse will happen to you the rest of the day.
Jaysen wrote: Mon Apr 29, 2019 3:44 pm I tried to say something but God thought I was wrong and filled my mouth with saltwater. I kept my pie hole shut after that.

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Re: Jaysen's Helms 24

Post by Jeff »

Nice Jaysen, Congratulations!!!!! Jeff


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Re: Jaysen's Helms 24

Post by Fuzz »

How did you survive in the horrible weather :doh:

You need a couple knots of current and 15 knots of wind running crossways to each other to really have some harbour fun :lol: :lol:

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