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CR13 build...I have altered the plan.

Posted: Tue Oct 25, 2016 11:26 am
by Corvidae
But I don't think I'll need to alter it any further.

This is more of a historical post than a build log, the boat was finished and launched a few days ago. Mainly I wanted to pass on the differences and atrocities that were committed during construction. First off, I figured out after making the V12, that once I have a completed boat in my garage, I don't have the room to make the rudder and daggerboard. So, I started with that first this time. Also, since the guy I sold the V12 to, found out that the daggerboard was not impervious to rocks at full sail, I made him a new one as well. Along with what turned out to be a great improvement.

First, both daggerboards, made to plan, clear epoxy, and a layer of 4oz. glass. The glass helps with abrasion resistance and adds a bit of weight, which is needed because they both still float. I later added some 17oz. glass to the upper body of the V12 daggerboard just to weigh it down some.
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Next step was hacking off the leading edge at the tips of both boards and making a flexible mold out of the hacked off bits.
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The mold was sprayed with pam, then filled with epoxy/graphite. Using a drill, small holes were peppered through both the resulting pieces and the daggerboards, giving a strong physical bond.
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A bit of sanding/shaving and then a few coats of spar varnish later and we end up with this:
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The smaller V12 board has had a lot more 'testing' than the CR13 board. However, we can say for certain that it will hold up to serious rock abrasion and impacts. At around 4 knots the V12 was brought to a complete stop by an immovable rock. The resulting scratch in the graphite epoxy is hard to find if someone doesn't point it out. So the extra work of molding and replacing the tips of the boards does seem to be worth the effort.

Next up, building a boat!

Re: CR13 build...I have altered the plan.

Posted: Tue Oct 25, 2016 1:45 pm
by Corvidae
Ok, so on to the actual boat. For the most part it's the same as other CR13 builds, lofted the plans to Okoume, cut out all the pieces, glued on the butt blocks, and bent everything around the first couple frames using a couple of drywall screws to hold the frames in place. I used zip ties instead of wire to hold things together this time. For the most part, easier to use, however I think for the transom, if doing this again, I'd go back to wire. At some point epoxy touches the zip ties and they end up permanently embedded in the hull. It's harmless, and easy to cover up or even drill out, but the wire was easier to simply yank out.

Initial frame up:
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Flipped and framed up the seats:
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And then we go off plan a bit:
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I was using the temporary crossbars to double check the measurements against the mast box that I had already made. The goal is that it hangs freely and is able to swing up all the way, without hitting any frames.
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Once the size was figured out, the shaped boards were mounted and epoxied in:
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At about the same time I cut the hole for the daggerboard trunk and slipped it in there. I didn't see anything in the plans about what to cap the trunk with, so I used a 2x8 with a slot cut in it.
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Also just because I could, I cut holes in the sides of the seats for storage areas with some limber holes for drainage. The front and back sections of the seats are still sealed as on the original plans.

Next up was sealing up the front section around the tabernacle. The extra floatation is nice, but mainly I just wanted to make it a more usable space.
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Re: CR13 build...I have altered the plan.

Posted: Tue Oct 25, 2016 3:02 pm
by Corvidae
And onward we plunge to the next change. I didn't like the way the frames broke up the floor space, mainly because I'm clumsy, but also because the plans showed the back frames as both solid pieces and as three separate pieces each. So rather than fuss about which way way right, I made my own way. And my own floor.

Starting with some simple framing.
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Which I epoxied in while doing the rub rails and other framing:
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Which ended up being oak rails with mahogany inlay:
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A few coats of paint later, and we have an interior!
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Next up, the horrors of the flip side.

Re: CR13 build...I have altered the plan.

Posted: Tue Oct 25, 2016 3:40 pm
by Corvidae
These next images might be highly offensive to wood workers and shipwrights. Proceed with caution.

As was mentioned in another thread, pulling the nose together on the CR13 involved some extreme acts of persuasion. Not only was a large bolt used at the forward point, but also a series of holes were used to bolt some scrap wood where needed to provide leverage.
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Now that interior is done though, it's time to try cleaning that mess up. A bit of sanding to get started:
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A quick coat of epoxy:
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A strip of 17oz matt backed fiberglass along the keel and overlapping 6oz fiberglass for the rest of the bottom:
Also popped on the backer for the bow hook.
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Cast a spell of invulnerability on the entirety of the bottom of the boat:
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And then painted it green:
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I'm happy with the green, not my first choice of color, but it works. If I get tired of it, it's easy enough to sand and cover next year, which I probably will once I've put enough scratches in it. At this point though, it's ready to flip and install that floor I framed out earlier.

Re: CR13 build...I have altered the plan.

Posted: Tue Oct 25, 2016 3:50 pm
by Corvidae
I think the internet is going to force me to stop here for the day. Been fighting the image host because of the ddos attack that's hitting the eastern US. Here's the last pic I was able to get cropped to size:

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Once I upload more I'll show the rigging and some floating shots.

Re: CR13 build...I have altered the plan.

Posted: Tue Oct 25, 2016 5:49 pm
by peter-curacao
Bravo very nice boat 8) 8)

Re: CR13 build...I have altered the plan.

Posted: Tue Oct 25, 2016 7:36 pm
by Jeff
Very nice work!! Looks really nice!! Jeff

Re: CR13 build...I have altered the plan.

Posted: Tue Oct 25, 2016 8:29 pm
by seaslug
Wow!! Super clean job, and a beautiful finished product. A boat to be proud of for sure.

Re: CR13 build...I have altered the plan.

Posted: Wed Oct 26, 2016 8:38 am
by Corvidae
Thank you all, it's been a fun build. I would have posted and documented as I went, but with the tabernacle changes I was keeping it a secret until I knew if it would work as planned. And it does work. Not only can I raise and lower the mast while on the water, it's also very easy to step the mast on land.

I know somewhere around here I have a better picture of the boat rigged without some fat guy sailing it. In the mean time, here's the one I do have:

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Hopefully this weekend I can get a good video of raising and lowering the mast. And I still need to finish the gunter rig I have started. The mast and spars are shaped, but need to be trimmed down to size and coated.

Re: CR13 build...I have altered the plan.

Posted: Wed Oct 26, 2016 9:47 am
by bateau-webmaster
Very cool. Curious how well the paint will hold up. It looked like there was no primer after the graphite layer? What did you use for topcoat?

Re: CR13 build...I have altered the plan.

Posted: Wed Oct 26, 2016 10:25 pm
by Corvidae
I didn't go with a primer, just a 150 grit sanding and rustoleum top coat. Takes a few days to set up, but after that it's very solid. The main thing is getting it on there as soon as the epoxy is sandable so that it bonds. It's all slow cure epoxy so it's almost a week before full cure sets in. I was always too slow to work with the faster cure epoxies, so it works out.

Re: CR13 build...I have altered the plan.

Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2016 10:47 am
by bateau-webmaster
Nice method. I might have to use that on some things. Never even considered trying to get the double bond on the topcoat.

Re: CR13 build...I have altered the plan.

Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2016 11:22 am
by Corvidae
You're probably using fast cure epoxy a lot more often than I do. The window for getting the top coat on there would be a lot shorter. With the slow cure, I could still scratch the top coat off with my fingernail a couple days after painting. After a week, it's more likely to tear my fingernail than the other way around. This coat is a bit of an experiment too, I'm expecting to sand and repaint the bottom after a year of use. I want to see how it stands up to the abuse. The same goes for the oak rails and the tabernacle hinge. They're under two coats of epoxy and three coats of spar varnish. I want to see what a years worth of dock impacts and mast raisings does to everything, then adjust as needed.

Re: CR13 build...I have altered the plan.

Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2016 11:36 am
by bateau-webmaster
Very nice. Honestly it's too hot here for anything but slow most of the time. Definitely a cool build.

Re: CR13 build...I have altered the plan.

Posted: Mon Oct 31, 2016 10:03 am
by Corvidae
That's right, I forget you guys are just up North of me. Got a suggestion for a sail maker? I have the plan for the Gunter rig for the OT16, but haven't decided on a place to order from yet.

Re: CR13 build...I have altered the plan.

Posted: Mon Oct 31, 2016 10:52 am
by tcason
one option for sails


http://www.sailrite.com/

Re: CR13 build...I have altered the plan.

Posted: Mon Oct 31, 2016 11:20 am
by terrulian
Very impressed with the build and particularly the tabernacle.
I ended up putting light glass on the gunwales of my V10 and then adding a rubber rub rail as well. I was concerned that once you ding the varnish and epoxy, a water stain will soon appear. As it turns out, dinging the gunwale is pretty easy...but I have a rowboat, not a sailboat, so you won't have those weapons flailing about. I'm going to post some shots of my boat in another 6 months or so showing the details of wear and tear from the use I commonly give it.

Re: CR13 build...I have altered the plan.

Posted: Mon Oct 31, 2016 12:06 pm
by bateau-webmaster
There is always the mainsail/jib for the CR13: http://bateau.com/proddetail.php?prod=CR13_SL

Re: CR13 build...I have altered the plan.

Posted: Mon Oct 31, 2016 12:49 pm
by Corvidae
Aha! You do have a sail section, I didn't see it when I went looking earlier. Maybe add it to the product section menu on the side bar there?

Anywho, I already have the spar set for the gunter rig made. Also I have a sail set very similar to the one on the CR13 plans, it's from a snark Wildflower. Unlike a typical Snark, it's a main/jib setup of nearly the same size as the CR13. The bonus to the snark setup is that the mast is split in the middle with a bayonet connector. So instead of lugging around a 20' mast, it's a pair of 10' poles that are barely longer than the boom. Which is what I'm hoping to have with the gunter rig as well, just without a jib. Also, I'd like a much smaller sail, the one I have doesn't have any reef points. It's way too much sail for me to single hand in high winds.

Re: CR13 build...I have altered the plan.

Posted: Mon Oct 31, 2016 5:58 pm
by Corvidae
Finally pulled out a tape measure on the sail/jib I'm using, and it's 83sq. ft. as opposed to the 102sq. ft. that the CR13 plan actually calls for. Turns out even that is too much for me to single hand in winds over 20mph. It's a fun ride with two people, and the bigger sail would probably be a blast. It's just too much for me to handle both sails and the tiller solo.

So I think I'll take advantage of being able to swap out the tabernacle box that I made to handle different masts. I can run a gunter rig, maybe with a reef, and easily cruise solo, or pull out the main/jib set for having some fun with a buddy.

Re: CR13 build...I have altered the plan.

Posted: Sun Apr 21, 2019 2:44 pm
by mpd84
Hello, i know this is a pretty old thread but i was wondering if you ever got a video of raising and lowering the mast. I am planning my CR13 build and this option looks very appealing. Also, do you have any advice or gotchas that i should be aware of in my build?

Awesome build by the way! Thanks for posting this!
Corvidae wrote: Wed Oct 26, 2016 8:38 am Hopefully this weekend I can get a good video of raising and lowering the mast. And I still need to finish the gunter rig I have started. The mast and spars are shaped, but need to be trimmed down to size and coated.

Re: CR13 build...I have altered the plan.

Posted: Sat Oct 05, 2019 8:25 pm
by Corvidae
I have since sold the boat actually. I might be able to get a video of the tabernacle working though. It's been through a few minor adjustments.

What I learned along the way is that it would be best to plan a way to place the mast fore or after depending on the rig. I had two separate masts that I used and they didn't have quite the same center of effort. The bermuda rig had a severe weather helm until I installed a bow sprit for the jib. That balanced it out very nicely. The gunther rig is still way off balance, the mast needs to be able 6 inches forward of where it is.

If I were to do it again, I'd use plywood to build bulkheads on either side of the box about 12 to 18 inches above the gunwhale height. And I'd have some peg stops in the top instead of a molded in hinge point. That way i could set the box where the mast/rig would balance better. The extra height would make rowing uncomfortable but a possibility, since as it is now the mast is right where your chest would be while sitting on the dagger board trunk. Also add a rest to the transom for when the mast is down. Right now the flag on top of the mast just dangles into the water, meaning you get sprinkled when you lower/raise the mast. Nothing serious, but annoying.

I also found that the shorter 10 foot gunther mast didn't need stay lines at all, the tabernacle box was plenty to steady it with just the bow line. For a taller bermuda rig, consider chain plates to put the say lines as far out as possible.

Last thing, wrap every wood/wood epoxy join in fiberglass. The tabernacle box, my gunnels and the mast all started to separate. I had to sand them down, fill the gaps with epoxy and throw some glass over all of them. It doesn't take much, the superlight glass is plenty, but it needs to be there.

Re: CR13 build...I have altered the plan.

Posted: Sat Oct 05, 2019 9:16 pm
by Bogieman
Nice! Are planning to build another?

Re: CR13 build...I have altered the plan.

Posted: Fri Oct 25, 2019 6:58 pm
by Corvidae
Went and bought myself a 40ft sailboat and moved onto it. Between the thousand things to fix on the big boat and the lack of build space it's going to be a while before I can build another. I'd really like to bang out a nesting dinghy that can sail. We'll see what the future brings though. I also have a dream of dual kayaks lashed into a catamaran. Space and time are at a big premium right now, so we'll have to see what the future holds.

Re: CR13 build...I have altered the plan.

Posted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 1:05 pm
by Bogieman
Corvidae wrote: Fri Oct 25, 2019 6:58 pm Went and bought myself a 40ft sailboat and moved onto it. Between the thousand things to fix on the big boat and the lack of build space it's going to be a while before I can build another. I'd really like to bang out a nesting dinghy that can sail. We'll see what the future brings though. I also have a dream of dual kayaks lashed into a catamaran. Space and time are at a big premium right now, so we'll have to see what the future holds.
Wow! 8)