Well, I'm having a hard time deciding, haven't I?BarraMan wrote: ↑Fri Nov 16, 2018 5:10 pm Christer, this has to be the most exasperating thread I have seen. You have talked about building boats from 21’ to 30+’ on the one hand, while on the other hand you talk about “economy” and saving on engine costs.
I don’t know your personal circumstances, but there are HUGE differences between the build, fit-out and operating costs of a 20’ vs a 30’ planing boat!
Given that you are looking at 25 - 30’ outboard powered boats, and the cost of petrol/fuel in Europe, I assume you have deep pockets!
Also, being so focused on the cats doesn't help matters, either...
With "economy", I don't necessarily mean that the engine should run only on petrol fumes, but obviously I don't want to spend $200 every time I go out, either. There are also interesting things happening with diesel outboards these days, and by the time I decide on a plan and get it built, the diesel outboards are hopefully available on the market. I don't know if it's a Norwegian thing or not, but we have "red diesel" available, which is tax and duty free. I think it's mainly for agricultural use, but I know several people using the red diesel in their boats with no issue. It's plain old diesel with red colouring added. No idea about the legality of it, though.
In any case, one of my main problems with picking a design, is that I love boating. I've been driving boats since I was 7 years old and have practically grown up in boats. The dragon (my fiancee) is not really a boat person, although she's grown to not dislike it so much over the years. We also have friends who like to go fishing, but have little to no experience being in a boat or out on the water at all, and they really don't like the rocking back and forth and get quite nervous. Hence, I want to, need to, have a boat that's stable, has high freeboard, doesn't jump around at speed and doesn't rock too much at rest. Thus, my slight fixation on the catamarans.
Given that most of the people we take out are landlubbers, they expect some comfort, like padded seats, not getting soaked.. things like that. Thus, the boat must meet these criteria. Ladies refuse to substitute buckets for toilets, so one must be on board. Granted, we're usually never too far from shore or a WC, so it's not a big problem as such, it just makes everything so much easier when 4 people don't have to pull in their lines because someone needs to pee.
With regards to speed - I love going fast just because I can, but with lots of people on the boat, we're not going fast, because we're out having a relaxing day on the water and/or beach somewhere. 15-ish knots on plane would be a good speed for that, but I'd like the possibility to go a lot faster if need be. So I want good range (large-ish tanks) and decent economy (see above).
There must also be a way to cover the boat somewhat to get out of the weather when it inevitably turns bad. I've compromised with myself and gone from a fully enclosed pilothouse to a dual console with a soft top, button-up or otherwise. I don't necessesarily need it heated as we don't use the boat when it's terribly cold, but if there's room for a small heater it's all the better.
Deep pockets? Not so much, but I'm thinking that price and cost doesn't really matter that much if I get what I want. I'll try and do it as cheaply as possible, but I'll pay to get what I want. In line with that thinking, I'll pay what it costs to keep it running, within reason.
That's another reason I'm looking at designs like the VT650 - it gives me everything I want and from the motorization outlines of 2x50HP to 2x90HP, it's reasonably cheap to run. My Suzuki DF50 uses very little fuel, so a VT650 with 2x75HP 'zuki 4-bangers should deliver both enough speed and decent fuel economy. Pretty much the only thing bothering me with the VT650 is that it needs a few more feet of length and a foot or so of width, and the targa arch needs to come aft a little but still not block fishability from the rear deck. That said, I don't think I would have any problems living with it as designed.
Oh yeah, another thing - the plans for it are AU$3250.
I also feel bad for discussing other designer's designs on here, I feel like such a spoilt brat and that I'm just critizing Jacques' designs. I don't mean to be a jerk and there are many very nice designs in the Bateau portfolio that likely would be perfect for my program, but either they can't be changed like I want them to (CT22), or they require too much power to move (CS/CX25), or there just is something that's not quite right. That goes for all the other designer's plans I've looked at as well!
In any case, I'm sorry if I come across as stubborn and condescending. I don't mean to. Sorry.