SC15 vs OT16 decision

[anonymous]

I've built two stitch and glue kayaks, and want to build a rowboat next. In most cases, I'll be rowing solo, but I'd like to be able to accomadate a passenger from time to time. For the most part, I paddle/row in moderately protected areas such as San Francisco and Tomales bays, and if conditions are good, out in the ocean.

I'm tending towards building the SC15 over the OT16 for several reasons: First, the SC15 appears to have more freeboard forward. Second, it's lighter and would be easier to drag or carry down to launch sites that are not accessable with a vehicle. Third, the single rowing setup in the OT16 seems to be weird - it looks like you've got to sit on a box with a seat in the middle of your shins. Perhaps I'm overlooking something, but it appears the SC15 is a better fit for my program.

A final question is about the internal layout of either boat. I understand that all pieces have structural importance, and moving or removing the seats may weaken the entire structure. That said, I'd like to be able to drop in a Piantedosi Row Wing. Is it possible to add reinforcement to the gunwales, or should I just consider the SC15 to be a good, fast fixed seat boat?

Thanks!

[anonymous]

Guest
You say you are looking to build a rowing boat and have narrowed it down to two boats. However niether is meant to be strictly a row boat. One is a sailboat the other a canoe built for using a motor. Can you be more specific in what you want it to do?

[Spokaloo]

Im guessing by SC15, you mean the SG15 Scilly Gig:



This is probably the best fixed seat boat of the fleet, with the Otter coming in a close second. The Otter is about double the weight, but will still be a fast boat in the water you are talking about.

In the image you are referring to the "box", thats actually what appears to be the rowing seat, if the oarlocks are placed where they look like they are. Look to the lines drawings for the true layout of the boat, not the renderings.

I think (have to check with the man) that a rowing rig might fit between the B and C bulkheads. That might throw her balance off a bit, but you can always ballast problems like that away.

If fast sliding seat rowing is your pleasure, the Orca sea kayak built deckless is a good rowing shell, but would be a little finicky for SF bay.

E

[anonymous]

The two boats I'm considerering are the Scilly Gig and the Otter 16. I'm pretty sure the Scilly is strictly a row boat. According to the Otter study plans, "The requirements for the Otter 16 were simple: an able open rowing skiff with an auxiliary sail. This had to be a row boat first" . Sounds like a row boat to me.

I've read as much as I can on the forums, and got more hits for the Scilly Gig when I searched for "SC15" as opposed to the correct "SG15". I know the SC16 is the Sport Canoe, but there is not an "SC15". Sorry for the confusion.

So far as what I'm intending to do with the boat: In the original message I said that most of my rowing would be solo trips in and around San Francisco Bay, with occasional short trips into the ocean when conditions permit. I'd like to get the pros and cons of the Scilly and the Otter from other open water rowers that have experience with these boats.

I've done some rowing in several borrowed boats: an Adirondack guide boat, an Alden ocean shell, and a Chamberlain dory. The Chamberlain was far and away my favorite, and behaved well even when I allowed confidence to override common sense. However, building a traditional boat is beyond my skill level, and I'd rather be out on the water than building a strong back and sweating over a steam box with a pile of planks.

My specific question is which boat will work best for a single rower in moderately rough and windy conditions? Does the removable mid-frame feature in the Otter mean the interior can be changed so one can row on a seat rather than on a box as is described in the study plans? Can either boat accommodate a Row Wing?

[flattie]

You mention that you had the opportunity to row an Adirondack Guideboat - if you don't mind - what was your opinion of it. I am very much in the same process you are and leaning towards the OT16 but have read favorable things about the Guideboat - particularly for open ocean rowing - Guideboats seem to do very well in events like the Blackburn Challenge.

I plan on visiting Mystic Seaport and availing myself of the opportunity to rent and row some of their rowboats including various dories, a herreshoff pulling boat, whitehalls, and wherry's.

Thanks

PS I too feel that the stitch and glue is most likely more accomodating than a traditional bent rib, lapstrake built boat for the first time builder...

[anonymous]

SC15 was the abbreviation for the scilly gig until recently. There has been confusion with the SC16 before.

I have SC15 and OT16 plans -- haven't built either. I think the main differences, aside from the lines, is that the SC15 is slightly more performant, with less capacity and less stable.

Scott

[JimW]

Scilly Gig is a sports car, Otter is a honda civic wagon.

[anonymous]

doh! SG15! I have the SG15 plans.

[Spokaloo]

Having rowed rowing shells, traditional flatiron skiffs, small sail craft, and owned a 17' Thames rowing skiff, Id err on the side of the Scilly.

Though the boats are similar, the Scilly shows far less waterline beam, as she has a smaller overall beam, and drafting less, she will be considerably narrower on the water. Looking at the lines drawing, she looks to have great reserve stability for the snottier days on the bay, and a full bow will ensure she lifts over the waves.

Both boats have a shape not unlike a Chamberlain Gunning Dory. Section shapes are similar, with overall proportions fairly close when compensating for only having 5 panels.

Both boats will work well for your intended purpose. The Scilly will be the faster, lighter, and easier to row/load of the two, while the Otter will be the larger, heavier, but more effective to keep momentum (a slight advantage, she isnt that much heavier) in head seas. Personally, Id prefer the faster, lighter boat for better rowing performance.

Neither boat is designed for a RowWing or Alden Oarmaster rig, but both could easily be accommodated. It is just a matter of placement, or potentially cutting the frames down to 3" and placing the rigger on top or over them. I modified a fixed seat boat into a sliding seat boat (Thames) by actually just building riggers and putting in sliding seat rails on top of the existing frames in situ. It was a little extra work, but turned out a very pleasurable boat to row.

E

[anonymous]

If raw speed were the only consideration, then a surf ski would seem to be the best open water boat. They regularly spank everyone in the singles category. For me, pleasurable rowing is a balance between exercise, relaxation and a little excitement.

From my perspective, the Adirondack guide boat has a couple of drawbacks. First, it's a wet ride. The bow is not all that buoyant, and it seemed to knife through rather than ride over steep chop. Secondly, the lower rowing position improves stability, but at the expense of reduced forward visibility. Finally, the overall motion of the guide boat felt twitchy, and did not seem to be as self tending as the Chamberlain dory. By this, I mean that it took more of an active effort on the part of the rower to keep her under control when the going gets rough. With the Chamberlain I could put more effort into rowing and less into keeping water from sloshing over the gunwales.

The success of the Adirondack guide boat in the Blackburn seems to be the result of seamanship and athletic ability more than an endorsement of it as a good all-round recreational open water boat. After all, Shackleton took the James Caird across the Southern Ocean, but if you had a choice, would your really want to use a 22-foot open boat for this sort of trip?

In a perfect world, Jacques would have produced a modern re-design of the Chamberlain gun dory, but it's looking like the Scilly Gig is the next best thing.