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I need some help on how to wrap and attach my new decks, as well as how much epoxy and glass I need to purchase.
The boat is constructed of poly resin/glass with wood core and floors.

In addition to the decks, I want to add some support to the rolled gunnels as a few areas have taken a few docking bumps prior to my ownership and they need to be refreshed/strengthened.

Now, how should I wrap the decks and bulkheads, and how should I glass them to the hull sides, transom, and deck?







This is a budget boat, so I plan to go with budget materials...although I did decide to use epoxy in lieu of poly.
However, I have no idea how much to use, and I hhave no idea what weight and types of glass I need.

Thanks in advance,
Shawn

PS: boat is 17' 3" overall.
Front deck is 5 foot long and 5 foot wide at its widest point. Rear deck is 7' wide, 13" tall,.and 18" deep.
Hull sides are 14" tall with a 1.5" radius rolled edge (this us where I want to add glass to the sides to stiffen it up)

Joel must have missed this, but I'll try to help. I do a lot of projects like that one, no problem.

Now, how should I wrap the decks and bulkheads, and how should I glass them to the hull sides, transom, and deck?

Looking at this picture



The first thing to do is grind off all the paint or gelcoat down to bare clean glass where the new frame meets the bottom, and the sides, and 6" out on either side. Same thing where the new deck meets the hull sides and transom. Clean it to bare glass all the way over that lip, and about 3" below the deck. Everywhere there will be glass has to be clean.

I would install the frame first. You will glue it in with epoxy thickened with wood flour, then build a filet around all the edges, inside and out. Over the filet you use 6", 12 ounce, 45/45 biax tape and glass the frame to the sole (floor) and sides, front and back.

Then you need to cut some cleats to support the deck, at the sides and along the transom. 1X2 pine is good. Mark and glue them in place. Along the top rear of the frame will also need a cleat for support the seat, glue that on too.

Coat all wood in epoxy, both sides, cleats, plywood, everything, 2 coats.

Smear plenty of glue on all the cleats and glue down the rear deck. Use the squeeze out to form filets along the sides and transom, then tape these in with biax tape. Let the tape roll over the gunwale lip and transom top. Another strip of tape along the forward seam. That edge will first need to be rounded over to about a 1/2" radius so the glass will conform.

Now you can cover the entire thing in glass cloth. I'd use 12 oz. biax cloth, some people recommend woven, but I like biax better.

The front deck will go the same way.

Bill of materials: pretty close anyway..

4.5 gallons epoxy (Marinepoxy)
5 pounds wood flour
50 yards of 12 ounce, 6", 45/45 biax tape
10 yards 12 ounce 45/45 biax cloth (50" wide) You will probably use about 7-8 but it's cheaper to buy 10.

Glassing in these frames and decks are really going to stiffen up the hull, but you can run lengths of the tape down the rolled gunwales to build them up. Patch any holes first. You could also add some foam stiffener panels on the sides if it still needs more.

I'll add a few pics that might help in a few minutes.

This should show what you are shooting for, see how you use cleats to support the deck...






Got any more questions, just ask, and oh yeah, welcome aboard

Excellent info, very clear. Pics look exactly like I was thinking in my head.

Now I need to decide exactly where I want to mount pumps/drains, etc.

Any input on how to drain the forward compartments without letting water in? I was thinking about a small hole, all the way inboard, in the aft-most bulkhead, right at the sole/deck level. Keep it plugged with a baitwell plug or something similar, this way water sloshing on deck can't go into the compartment. However, if somehow a hatch is open in the rain or it happens to leak, I can still drain it. Sounds like the best solution, input?

Also, I'm still debating on whether or not to add a gunnel cap like you see on the PH boats. I may do this, which would really stiffen the sides. If so, I assume that a simple vertical stiffener/fishing rod rack underneath the caps, in addition to the gunnel cap, would be all I need? I would obviously glass it in just like you mentioned above with tape/fillets.

One last thing. On the transom, there is no 'rolled edge'. The rolled portion terminates on the sides of the boat, and doesn't bend around onto the transom. When I have the engine jacked up, and I'm on plane, I get some water splashing and hitting the poling platform just right so that it splashes into the boat. If I add a 'rolled edge' on the transom, or at least about 12" of it on each side of the boat, I wouldn't get this splash. I was thinking about clamping a piece of PVC with the same radius at the rolled edge, waxing it, and laying my glass/epoxy over top of it to form a rolled edge. Sound reasonable?

I appreciate your input. I'm dying to get this done.

What type of clearance/gaps are acceptable in between the frames and sole/seat top? The boat is not 100% square, so I did my best to use cardboard to make templates. There are areas where they are fairly tight, and areas where there is 1/8" or 3/16" of light shining through. Should I clean these up more, or is this acceptable? I know the fillet will fill these voids, but wasn't sure how much was too much.

Also...

Cracker Larry wrote: Bill of materials: pretty close anyway..

4.5 gallons epoxy (Marinepoxy)

5 pounds wood flour
50 yards of 12 ounce, 6", 45/45 biax tape
10 yards 12 ounce 45/45 biax cloth (50" wide) You will probably use about 7-8 but it's cheaper to buy 10.

Glassing in these frames and decks are really going to stiffen up the hull, but you can run lengths of the tape down the rolled gunwales to build them up. Patch any holes first. You could also add some foam stiffener panels on the sides if it still needs more.

I'll add a few pics that might help in a few minutes.

Is the epoxy resin & hardener combined to total 4.5gal, or do you think I need about 4.5gal of unmixed resin, plus hardener?

Thanks again.

Yes, every bulkhead needs a water drain. In forward compartments I use a standard 1" brass drain tube that you can plug, or remove. Bateau sells the drain tubes also. That rear frame will need a drain to the transom also. I'd use either 1 big one in the middle, or 2 small ones near each corner.

Also, I'm still debating on whether or not to add a gunnel cap like you see on the PH boats. I may do this, which would really stiffen the sides. If so, I assume that a simple vertical stiffener/fishing rod rack underneath the caps, in addition to the gunnel cap, would be all I need? I would obviously glass it in just like you mentioned above with tape/fillets.

I'd skip that, on that boat. Just a lot of weight and expense, no real gain, you mentioned a budget There are much easier ways to stiffen the sides. Once those decks and frames get glassed in, you may not need anything at all.

I was thinking about clamping a piece of PVC with the same radius at the rolled edge, waxing it, and laying my glass/epoxy over top of it to form a rolled edge. Sound reasonable?

That will work, but it will take multiple layers of the 12 oz. glass, maybe 10 or 12. For that I would get a yard or 2 of 1708 glass, much heavier and better suited for building thickness.

What type of clearance/gaps are acceptable in between the frames and sole/seat top? The boat is not 100% square,

They are never square, it drives me nuts That boat above was off by almost 2 inches With epoxy, you want some gap, 1/8 is no problem at all. Perfect.

Is the epoxy resin & hardener combined to total 4.5gal, or do you think I need about 4.5gal of unmixed resin, plus hardener?

That's total, 3 gallons resin, 1.5 hardener. That should do it if you don't waste much.

Thanks again...

Playing daddy daycare today with a sick kiddo. Hopefully I can get back in the garage tomorrow and finish cutting all of the frames and laying out the cleats.

I'll take a look at those drains.


When you said 2-coats of epoxy on everything, minimum - does that mean 2 coats, THEN glass and the epoxy required to wet it out? Or does the wet glass count as a coat in the areas receiving glass?

Thanks again,
Shawn

I've got a better thought than the PVC mold and glass for the transom top. How about just taking a pine 2X2, rounding over the 2 outside edges and glue it along the top edge?

When you said 2-coats of epoxy on everything, minimum - does that mean 2 coats, THEN glass and the epoxy required to wet it out? Or does the wet glass count as a coat in the areas receiving glass?

Good question. No. It means 2 coats on everything that doesn't get glassed. It really isn't necessary to glass the bottom side of the decks, the cleats, compartments that will be foam filled, or the inside surfaces of the frames unless they will get a lot of abrasion from anchors or something. Any surface that doesn't get glassed gets 2 coats of epoxy. Then you will never get water intrusion into the wood grain.

One more comment I feel I should add. That boat probably had some floatation foam under the rear deck and forward deck. On a boat that size it is a USCG requirement for it to have level, upright floatation. Not only is it the law, but it makes good sense.

Think about sectioning off some compartments under the deck, use some for storage and some for foam. The life you save may be your kids. A 2 gallon foam kit will make 8 cubic feet and float about 480 pounds.

You can see here I've broken the area under the deck into 5 compartments, 3 are for foam, 2 are for storage. The owner raised cane with me, he wanted more storage. Too bad, so sad, I told him. If I fix it and send it out, the SOB is going to float like it's supposed to if it gets swamped. Otherwise, get somebody else to fix it. You see it has foam

The port aft box will be a baitwell - anything special I need to do with it for holding water? I assume as long as it is good and coated, then painted, I should be safe. Should I go ahead and glass the entire interior of that compartment just to be safe?

As for foam - I'm an active duty coastie...I know all too well about all of that stuff! I was planning to section off a good part of that middle box in the stern, just not sure exactly where yet. I need to lay out all of my rigging and figure out where I am putting the foam.

The stbd box is the battery box, and I will have plenty of extra room in there for foam as well.

On the Port box, being the baitwell, I am considering making the baitwell about 2-3" smaller on all sides than the box. This will allow me to fill with foam, and insulate it at the same time.

Thanks again. Hopefully I can get an order placed before too long. I may hold off until after memorial weekend. A few cables, wires, and lines - and the boat is operational again. I've got family who may come over that weekend who will want to go fishing, so it may all get delayed a bit.

Good idea on the rolled gunnel at the transom...

Thanks again,
SQ

I would use glass in the bait well for sure.

As for foam - I'm an active duty coastie...I know all too well about all of that stuff!

Excellent, and thank you for your service

Cracker Larry wrote:I would use glass in the bait well for sure.

As for foam - I'm an active duty coastie...I know all too well about all of that stuff!

Excellent, and thank you for your service

My pleasure!

I'll keep you guys posted on my progress. Not sure when I will make the order, looks like about $500 worth of goodies.

Thanks again!

sorry I missed this one until now. i will take the original questions one at a time, but Cl has already make recommendations that will work very well.

I need some help on how to wrap and attach my new decks

It looks like you have some fir there to make your parts. I would cover all the surfaces of that wood with a 10 woven cloth, its inexpensive and it will keep the wood grain from checking and also give good abrasion resistance.

Now, how should I wrap the decks and bulkheads, and how should I glass them to the hull sides, transom, and deck?

tabbing the new parts into the hull should be done with 12 oz biax tape. That rear box/casing deck should get two layers of the tabbing.

grind back the gelcoat anywhere you will be glassing part - new glass has to be made to the old glass, not on top of the glecoat

Hull sides are 14" tall with a 1.5" radius rolled edge (this us where I want to add glass to the sides to stiffen it up)

to stiffen up the sides, adding glass will not do a lot by itself, you need to create a shape that will stiffen it. Gunnels would certainly do the trick, but thats a lot of work.

One very easy (and in expensive) way to add a lot of stiffness would be to glass a half round piece of PVC pipe to the sides, right below the sheer. You cut the pipe in half length wise, then glass it to the sides, overlapping the top and bottom of the hull sides. PVC can be a very light gauge. You dont need much glass, a couple layers of 12 oz biax or one layer 1708 is more than enough. The PVC doubles as good place to run wires.

The suggested BOM CL made is a good one. I would only add a bag of silica (add to woodflour to make fillets), and you can use 12 oz biax or the 10 woven for covering the wood. the 12 oz biax takes turns much nicer, but the 10 oz takes less fairing (not by much) and its a bit cheaper.

Sorry again that I missed the thread until now

Thanks Shine!

I'll play with the hull sides and see how much more stiffening the rolled edge needs. The factory rolled edge is plenty strong. There are just a few areas where there was some 'dock crashing' done, and it weakened the rolled edge. I am mainly looking to fix/stiffen these areas, not necessarily the whole rolled edge. I don't plan on crashing it into my dock, so more rigidity shouldnt be needed. Mainly just repairing it back to the way it was originally.

In regards to the fairing on the different cloths: I plan to durabak all of the areas that will have work done on them (except the inside of the baitwell). So, I'm not too worried about fairing a whole lot. Some of the finishes you guys achieve with fairing/painting are amazing. Luckily, this boat doesn't need to meet those standards because it would take me forever to get there!

Thanks again,
Shawn

plan to durabak all of the areas that will have work done on them

that certainly makes it easier

Quick question; how much 'flash' time is minimum for in between coats of epoxy?

For instance: If I am taping/filleting joints on the bulkheads/frames, how long do I need to let them set before I apply a complete coat over the bare wood?

I'm trying to gauge how much time I will need to do all of the glass work once everything is laid out. I know if I let anything sit too long I will have to sand. But, can you let it sit 'too short' and mess it up by applying over top of it too soon?

Thanks,
Shawn

No, no flash time required between coats, as fast as you can work is fine.