CV16 Wyvern

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chrisobee
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CV16 Wyvern

Post by chrisobee »

I've begun again to work on my CV16. My work space is limited. My project began several years ago and never saw much progress. I've done some work and now have my basic hull assembled. In the last week I cobbled together a cradle on wheels and flipped the boat. Next I will work on fillets and taping the inside seams

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Spango
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Re: CV16 Wyvern

Post by Spango »

Looks good :lol:

chrisobee
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Re: CV16 Wyvern

Post by chrisobee »

Spango wrote:Looks good :lol:

Thanks for the encouragement. :D

I've acomplished a lot. last night I filleted and taped the bow and stern. The laminations turned out well but I do have work on my neatness. today I will do the rest of the chine in between. Then on to the frames and the centerboard case. my front frame does not fit very well and I need to do some reshaping there. It's funny the way my mind works. I'm working on taping the seams and doing best to make good laminations and all the while my brain is running over details of the the work on the frames and centerboard case.

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ks8
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Re: CV16 Wyvern

Post by ks8 »

Hey hey! Looks good! :)

I've added more confusion to your other thread about frame taping. It was a challenge to add the most confusion using the fewest words, but I think I managed it fairly well. :P

Unless J answers definitively before I post there again, I'm looking for my replies from him from many years ago. You are not alone in not quite comprehending an exact lamination schedule, but certainly do tape the frames, more so the midframe, and transom, depending on engine plan and weight. See the other thread. 8)

As a general rule, I believe it has been said before that if there appears to be a discrepancy between the plans and the *assembly instructions*, it is safer to pay attention to the plans details rather than the text assembly instructions, as the plans are more reliably updated, or have corrections and additions here on the site. BUt it is always best to have the definitive answer from J or Evan, etc.

Good to hear you are back at it. :D

chrisobee
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Re: CV16 Wyvern

Post by chrisobee »

ks8 wrote:Hey hey! Looks good! :)
And here I was worried that you were snubbing me. :D
Unless J answers definitively before I post there again, I'm looking for my replies from him from many years ago. You are not alone in not quite comprehending an exact lamination schedule, but certainly do tape the frames, more so the midframe, and transom, depending on engine plan and weight. See the other thread.
I think his answer was not to answer in the face of answer I got from C.L. I've done quite a bit of work this weekend. I did tape in the fore and aft frames. I used the woven tape. After examining the plans and notes extensivly I decided that the biax should be used on the chines, keel, transoms, centerboard case and the mid frame. The woven tape on the fore and aft frame and on all the seats. So now I have the inside seams all done and the fore and aft frame permanantly attached.

Next I will flip the boat again and do the outside seams. I may be running out of biax. I laid out what I have left and I think I have enough to do the outside seams but not the mid frame and centerboard case.

On the learning to sail front I recently attended a sailing school North of Columbus. That was a kick. I basically spent one day in a class room, listening to the thunder, and the next day sailing a sunfish. 280 pound men ought not to sail a sunfish. The air was light and I had to sit perched precariously in the corner of the cockpit. Still I had a great time. Went scooting up one side of the lake and back down again. So its official, I'm a hazard to navigation and the object of many fisherman's scorn. Perhaps my instructor should have told me they were trolling. :roll:


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chrisobee
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Re: CV16 Wyvern

Post by chrisobee »

Hey KS....

Do you have the performance sailplan or the regular?

What was the final weight of your boat?

ks8
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Re: CV16 Wyvern

Post by ks8 »

Regular sail plan. If you haven't got any rig yet, consider having at least one reef sewn in, maybe at 4 or 6 feet. On some days, if single handing, it will be the difference between heading out or sitting on the beach.

What's she weigh? Oh sure... and next you'll want to know her age. You just don't ask a lady these things... :lol:

Since I used less than ideal wood, and glassed everything, and beefed up for mod mount points, etc. Well, I tried to weigh her, but the standard scales didn't work out... not accurate at their high end. Judging by various attempts, and inaccuracies, I'm saying a bit over 500 lbs. All that glass adds up quick. But putting things in perspective, she does hull speed easily and has a nice smooth ride, which was the plan. Not too much like a cork on the high seas. Easy motion. Probably the only drawbacks will be light air performance compared to a 250 lb boat, and final ultimate capacity/freeboard. But it works for me as is. I ran up one very stoney shore, big sharp stones, and then into another (never to be repeated I hope... :lol: ) and have only a few scratches on the glassed bottom, not even deep enough to be gouges. The over-glassing already paid for itself in that regard, and I now feel better about loaning her out, if I ever finish painting her... :?

I haven't found that taping schedule but I think it sounds like you are on your way. Like me, you may need to buy some additional biax. I couldn't stand how the woven tape laid out and did the seats with all biax instead, the 6 oz on the tops and 12 oz on the bottom bonding the seat risers/stringers to the hull. My seat tops are glassed on both sides too. That added weight but also lots of strength. Confidence stomping on them now. If you don't foam the four compartments, you really need a good batten down the center. It will make all the difference on the strength and flex of the seat top once you bond it down good to the batten. :)

Picture taken from under seat through the access hatch. That bond to the central batten stiffened the seat top nicely.
Image

I'm almost tempted to build another as light as possible, already having the rig. But leaning more toward a VG18, dreams anyway. :)

chrisobee
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Re: CV16 Wyvern

Post by chrisobee »

I can't say that I'm a fan of the woven tape either. Its only attractive quality is that I have about 85 yards of the stuff. It has one edge that is very thick and it comes unraveled very easilly. I'm going to experiment with sanding down the thick edge, perhaps I can improve it somewhat with a little attention. I must resist the temptation to buy a dremel tool. No more tools.

I think I'm going to need to order about 10 yards of biax to finish the boat. I think I have enough for the outside seams. I'll be pretty dissapointed if I can't finish the outside seams

I'm going to fill the four corner compartments with foam and leave the middle ones available for storage by cutting an enlongated oval in the front of the middle seat . I will attach stiffeners under the middle seat I expect the foam to work to support the front and back. I will probably tape a pair of 1x1 to the bottom of the seat tops

I will build a platform in the cuddy, square over the keel for a 12v. battery box. I will run conduit down the starboard side under the seats and install two recepticles probably just behind the aft frame. Maybe just in front it would be more accessable. One recepticle will be for my trolling motor. The other will be a cigarette lighter style recepticle. I'll probably put a bus bar on the back side of the fore frame in case I want to install lights later. Do masts have quick dissconnects when they have a mast head light? I will probably bury a wire in the keel fillet from the cuddy to the back of the mast step.

I intend to put in a support for the middle of the fore deck that will emerge from the deck to become the fore stay attachment point. this support will run from the front transom back to the front frame and be taped and filleted to both. I will glue the deck to the top of the support. I'm also tempted to install a bit of trim at the top of the fore frame to channel water to the sides.

I am also now thinking about painting the boat. First you must adjust your attitude to my expectation. This will not be objet d'art such as the M.O.F. masterpiece but rather a much rougher boat. What sort of paint do you think I should use. I teeter between the porch paint approach and using S3 products rolled and tipped.

Porch paint over S3 pros
Cheap

Cons
It would be the first real departure from the use of quality material. All my ply is Merenti, All my epoxy is S3.
S3 will be prettier.

chrisobee
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CV16 Wyvern

Post by chrisobee »

Flipped the boat and started to repair the bottom seams in preparation for the applicaiton of biax tape. I can easilly lift the stern and press it over my head. At this point I hazard a guess that the boat weighs in at about 150 lbs.

ks8
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Re: CV16 Wyvern

Post by ks8 »

Here's some thoughts. Enjoy building her the way you will. Having sailed MOF, here's some ideas... first for the build and the woven tape...
chrisobee wrote:I can't say that I'm a fan of the woven tape either. Its only attractive quality is that I have about 85 yards of the stuff. It has one edge that is very thick and it comes unraveled very easilly. I'm going to experiment with sanding down the thick edge, perhaps I can improve it somewhat with a little attention.
When I do use the woven, I first cut off the larger edge. If you are reasoably careful, the fibers don't really fall apart much at all. It saves on the grinding and a little of the fairing, but takes time to cut (nothing compared to time grinding).
I must resist the temptation to buy a dremel tool. No more tools.
hmmmm.... I'll be quiet, except to say that I found it as handy as the RO, and used it almost as much. :lol:
I think I'm going to need to order about 10 yards of biax to finish the boat.
Go for it. I'm glad I've got two layers on the inside of the CB case to hull bottom seam. When crew leans on it, there are no worries now. :)

When underway...
...

I will run conduit down the starboard side under the seats and install two recepticles probably just behind the aft frame. Maybe just in front it would be more accessable.
I'm thinking just in front would be better... less *in the wayable* and just as accessible. A small box on the seat top, or above it, on the forward part of the rear frame, keeps the helm area clear. It is good to have that helm area clear with the least possible things on which the sheets might get snagged. With socket face oriented downward, you will plug the plug *up into the socket*. Makes rain water a non issue, the socket is completely rain proof with the enclosing box over it. If it powers a GPS and fishy finder, I find them best right in front of me on the seat, while in use. When I switch from side to side, they both move with me. I'll be mounting both on a small platform with a central short power lead to both, meaning only one wire to the *module*. That makes it that much easier to move both at once from side to side, with the single power and sonar cable a minimal concern. The power cable will have twisted leads to minimize messing up the nearby compasses. The helmsman rarely needs to go forward while underway. If you're fishing, it is a great convenience for easy clear access to both gadgets, to find bottom structure, and to mark it.

You can put a receptacle box right on the transom and stern seat top, for the trolling motor, and have some sort of conduit channel that runs through the under rear seat *foaming* too, for when you need to replace that heavy gauge wire. But tape the seat top to the transom and hull side before building such a box (if you put it right in the corner of the seam). That taped seam is structural. I'd also consider angling the receptacle down slightly and under a small overhang, in case it rains... and have the plug parallel to the transom surface so it doesn't stick into people traffic places. I can sketch if you like. And you can also completely ignore me. I'm sure what you come up with will be fine.

We are told not to solder the socket leads. Crimp and heat shrink tubing. VIbration causes metal fatigue and failure sooner with a soldered joint, though it may not be an issue in your lifetime... :lol: :)
I'll probably put a bus bar on the back side of the fore frame in case I want to install lights later.
Great idea. Its best put in a box so nothing loose in the cuddy can short it out. And fuse the run to it from the battery, and the runs out from it to the devices.
Do masts have quick dissconnects when they have a mast head light?
Yes.
I will probably bury a wire in the keel fillet from the cuddy to the back of the mast step.
I wouldn't mess with the structure of that seam at all by burying wire in it. Run the masthead light wire under the stbd seat also (in conduit in foam for easy replace), bring it out of the seat riser just forward of the main frame, and maybe run it in a piece of channel stock, stuck (with double sided tape) to the forward side of the main frame and then along the bottom of the CB case, under the pivot bolt, and to the mast step. Leave that keel seam structural with proper materials. :)
I intend to put in a support for the middle of the fore deck that will emerge from the deck to become the fore stay attachment point. this support will run from the front transom back to the front frame and be taped and filleted to both. I will glue the deck to the top of the support.
This arrangement, as given on the plans, is very strong. I biaxed the forward part of it to the bow transom. It has been tested in strong wind that pulled the jib sheet out of my hands.
I'm also tempted to install a bit of trim at the top of the fore frame to channel water to the sides.
A breakwater is a great idea, and looks good. The most water you will get is when heading into a chop and wind, at 3.5 to 5 knots (and that will get you all the way back at the helm as it sheets off the bow transom and blows back on you!), or when it rains. The break water doesn't need to be large at all. 3/4 inch high and rounded top will still allow someone to sit on the edge of the deck facing in the boat, mostly comfortable. If the sky really pours the water down, you're gonna get wet, and maybe gain or lose a super power in a flash and boom (been there... no... I won't tell what the super power is).

Before going to paint... I find the sheet cleats at the helm position essential. Everyone is different when it comes to such preferences, but I put it out there for you to think about. The pictures are in my gallery. You could through bolt them right to the seat tops instead of the extra structures I used, but use backing plates. The jib sheet cleat has a load on it that was able to rip the sheet out of my grip in a blow. I used the stronger metal cam cleat for the jib sheet. The main sheet has a 2:1 purchase. No cam cleats failed yet. But I'm wearing the gloves now. :)
I am also now thinking about painting the boat. First you must adjust your attitude to my expectation. This will not be objet d'art such as the M.O.F. masterpiece but rather a much rougher boat. What sort of paint do you think I should use. I teeter between the porch paint approach and using S3 products rolled and tipped.
S3, I believe, will be adding an additional layer of water seal protection over the epoxy and primer. I am doubtful about how well the porch paint would seal it further.

Well, there's some ideas. No matter what you decide, don't forget a picture now and then. :)

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