Keel of Adelie 16

[gonandkarl]

Hi Tony,
Salvatore thinks it will right itself easyly even when the keel is up because it is nevertheless very low in the boat in the 4 inch high keelshoe. I think it is also because of the whale like shape of the Adelie it will right itself easyly. Companionway boards in position and hatch cover locked on top should keep the water out of the cabin. Remember it was you quite some time ago who told me how I can secure the hatch with 2 side rails. I made it exactly like you told me. I must only add a latch to make it lockable. I hope this helps the guy who started this thread in making up his mind to build an Adelie.
I think it is a nice sail boat for day sails and is not meant for regatta sailing.
Greetings from Karl

[Jaysen]

Setting aside the righting momentum issue...

If one were to lock the CB down to prevent the swing (assuming a cable system), wouldn't that lead to increased likely hood of damage in shoal water? Given that we are talking about 16' craft with quite a bit of sail, I'm kind of assuming lake, inshore, or very nearshore areas. With the exception of lakes, the other areas would tend to be prone to shoaling. My concern would be less about the CB/trunk in an impact but the rigging (recently watched a Benateau 4something dismast running into sand bar with full main and spin flying in 15kn; i suspect there was already damage or improper maintenance on stays, but..)(I never have my phone in video mode at the right times).

If shoal water is NOT a concern and the only reason for lifting CB is trailering, then a simple pin or a lock block would be the simplest answer.

Assuming a dagger style lifting keel is nowhere on JM design specification (SB18 style)...

[terrulian]

Well, hmmm. Should I admit I have touched a few times with my Catalina, the keel of which is not locked down? What a great thing to be able to just crank it up and get off. Not like a fixed keel boat...not that I've ever gone aground in one of those.

Anyway, you are right, Jaysen, that since you have a lever arm there, should the end of the keel touch the bottom, any gear that held it in that position better be sacrificial, because it will be stressed.

[das boot]

I had the same thought when I built my AD16 the solution was simple I had to drill a hole through the top of the keel box and put a pin through it to keep the keel up when it is on the trailer when I lower the keel I put the pin back through the top of the keel box that stops it from becoming tottley retracted if you are upside down you need to store that pin somewhere anyway.
When I built my keel I put an eye bolt into the top of the keel at the back and counter sunk the nuts on the eye bolt into the keel to keep them solid I have a cable with an eye on it that I slide a short conduit pipe through the eye at the top and use it as a handle to pull the keel up and hold it with one hand and slide the bolt pin through the hole this has worked just fine for 6-7 years. I can send you pictures if you like

[terrulian]

I would be concerned that the probability of major damage from that pin to the hull structure if you hit something hard at speed outweighs the insurance you gain in the very unlikely event of a capsize. But I don't know this boat and this is really a question for the designer--who is apparently taking his retirement seriously!!

[jacquesmm]

Do not worry about the capsizing, the boat is very stable.
I would not put a pin there but if you absolutely want one, make a pin from a thin wooden dowel.
Or use a small line holding the CB down, that line attached to a jam cleat.

I would not do anything.

About retirement: I am camping in places really far away from everything and have rarely phone or internet access. I will be back end June.

[terrulian]

Good on you, Jacques.

[gonandkarl]

Hi jbro5000
A thin wooden dowel as Jacques said makes the most sense because if you hit the ground it would break. I think I will forget the stainless steel pin which I had planned for my Adelie.
Have you made up your mind to build an Adelie 16 we have not heard from you lately.
Greetings from Karl

[jbro5000]

Thanks to those who kindly posted the helpful replies to my query on how to keep the Adelie 16 centre board (CB) down in the event of a fully inverted capsize. While the points made are qualitative they are based on actual experience and I appreciate that quantifying stability values for various weight distributions on such a small vessel may not be realistic.
Nevertheless, my question remains: What condition is the basis of the designed feature of 135 degrees of positive stability mentioned in the study plan? CB half-down, or fully down?
An indication from the designer on this point would be useful to know.
In this regard, what seems odd is that according to the plans (eg Centre-board profile, Sheet B268/9) the CB is not designed to be capable of being lowered beyond half-way because the flattened upper end will jam up against the CB housing. However, that neither conforms with the study plan indicative draft of 35 inches, nor, the fact that folks seem to have referred to a fully down CB as their normal sailing condition, a condition that carries some risk of CB retraction unless locked.
On the latter point, the suggestion of a light dowel that would break in a grounding is a good practical idea and I will look carefully to see where that could be located on my vessel which is not yet built.
One thought is that it may be reasonable to add an extra (second) 6 inch lead pie at the bottom end of the CB, where there is space for it, and to sail in all sea state conditions with the CB locked in the half way down position as per the drawings provided. That may not require lowering the CB to a fully down position to keep the range of positive stability more or less as designed.
This would add 60 pounds to the total displacement. Or, put another way, reduce the deadweight, ie the amount of stores the vessel will carry at the design draft by 60 pounds, which may important in some situations.
Thanks for your consideration.

[Jaysen]

This response is from the designer. As he noted in the last sentence he will be slow to reply for a few weeks.

Do not worry about the capsizing, the boat is very stable.
I would not put a pin there but if you absolutely want one, make a pin from a thin wooden dowel.
Or use a small line holding the CB down, that line attached to a jam cleat.

I would not do anything.

About retirement: I am camping in places really far away from everything and have rarely phone or internet access. I will be back end June.