Vagabond 20 questions for Jacques

Sail Boats 15' and up. Please include the boat type in your question.
Jeff
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Vagabond 20 questions for Jacques

Post by Jeff »

This question arrived via email over the weekend: "Greetings, I am planning to build a weekend cruiser boat in the 18-20 feet range and Vagabond 20 caught my eye, looks good in the study plans. It's cabin seems wider, (although may also be shorter) and it's a heavier boat then my other alternative. However, one of my concerns is the complexity of the keel system as seen in project just right. I guess there is a deeper steel keel option as well, but I wonder whether a simpler lifting keel option was available to keep it trailable and simpler to build." Jeff



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Re: Vagabond 20 questions for Jacques

Post by jacquesmm »

Somewhere, in my design archives, I have drawings for a fixed, deeper keel but are you willing to cast a lead keel shoe?
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Sarp
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Re: Vagabond 20 questions for Jacques

Post by Sarp »

Thank you for the prompt response Jacques. I'm new to amateur boat building and Vagabond 20 will be my first project, it is probably the finest looking sailboat I have seen over the past weeks of searching trough multiple boat designs around this size. I will go over the plans and tutorials in the following few weeks and hopefully start building within a month or two.

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Re: Vagabond 20 questions for Jacques

Post by new to sail »

Sarp
Welcome to the Board. Looking forward to seeing another Vagabond 20 build.

Rick

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Re: Vagabond 20 questions for Jacques

Post by Sarp »

Thanks Rick, hopefully I will be able to start within a month or two.

2 questions came to mind, please forgive my inexperience if the questions seem illogical.

I'm going over the keel plans and the fixed keel looks good. Am I correct to assume that the boat will have better stability as opposed to the drop keel with plywood frame version, since it's cg is significantly deeper (By rough estimates, it has around 80-85L of inner volume, which 21-22L of it filled with lead seems enough to end up with a 250kg keel). However, the shallower lifting keel option also sounds good for easier trail-ability. I was wondering if I could have a shallower fixed keel, like chopping off the bottom part by say 15-20cm (somewhere around cg of lead from bottom). Would adding an additional 20-40kg of lead to this new shallower fixed keel give me comparable stability?

My second question is regarding headroom inside the cabin. I was hoping that the cabin headroom would be around 110-120cm and was a little worried to see that it's 99-107cm. I read in the FAQ that although not recommended, the size of the plans can be stretched up to 10% without major changes to dynamics. I was thinking whether stretching the plans on side panels to give a little more headroom, is feasible or not (5-10% accounts to roughly 4-8cm increase in headroom and 1-2cm wider hull overall)? It may affect the looks and plywood optimization, will it also have an impact on stability? Finally, shall a first time amateur builder stick to the plans 100%?

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Re: Vagabond 20 questions for Jacques

Post by jacquesmm »

Keel first:
The plans show two keel versions: a CB keel and fixed deeper keel.
You choose which one you want. You listed the pros and cons: trailer ability or a little more righting moment but not much.
If it was possible to design a simple fixed keel with lees draft and same LCG, I would have done so.
It is possible to draw some type of bulb keel but that keel would be very difficult to build by an amateur.
BTW, I hope you realize that the deep keel is a welded keel.
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Re: Vagabond 20 questions for Jacques

Post by jacquesmm »

Scaling and headroom:
this is a small boat and I can't give you more headroom without major distortion.
You could scale but why not, instead of scaling, pick plans for a larger boat like the VG23?
I can supply the fixed keel plans for the VG20 with that set of plans and you would have to scale the keel only.
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Sarp
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Re: Vagabond 20 questions for Jacques

Post by Sarp »

Unfortunately, I only have access to a building site where the outside frame doors are 2.40m, so a VG23 would not work, besides I already got the plans.

Is it possible that I can get a little more headroom with some tweaks like lowering the front triangle bed floor by 5-7cm and possibly enlarging the space around the sliding cabin cover?

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Re: Vagabond 20 questions for Jacques

Post by Sarp »

Dear Jacques,

I studied the plans and noticed that I have about 6% margin within the plywood dimension limitations (125*250cm metric) and a 6% increase in overall height, can increase my headroom over the side bunks from 82 to roughly 89cm (Bulkhead E). My car's rear seat headroom is 90cm, I believe I would feel crowded if it was 7-8cm lower, so I believe this upgrade can be worth it. I can also increase the width by 6% to keep the proportions. All bottom and hull sideplate width dimensions are increased by 6%, so as the corresponding outer bulkhead faces. My question is do I have to increase overall lenght by 6% as well or, keeping the boat at 6m original lenght would not compromise it's stability or handling at this level.

Thank you for your help.

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Re: Vagabond 20 questions for Jacques

Post by jacquesmm »

Scaling 6% is reasonable. You may have to add a little ballast but that would make the boat more stable.
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